Not many episodes occur completely in one place... and here we are at the Wall for an hour. So...
Give me your thoughts on Aemon... because he's awesome and deserves some Sidepiece time.
Non book readers... when Sam promised not do to die, did you assume he's gonna die (aside from your Team America connection)? I mean, it's the Game of Thrones.. you can't make that promise!
"Jon Snow is mine..." Did she mean to kill, or to keep? Why didn't she keep her word when the Magnar of Thenn was fighting Jon!?
What'd you think of the Giants, Mammoths? Mags running at the inner gate? (a part of me wanted to see what took place down there, and not just the aftermath. It would have been more dramatic at least, if somebody went to check in there earlier, right?)
The contraption on the wall to stop the climbers? Where was that when Jon and them were climbing the wall before?
Ygritte's hesitation to kill Jon... was she going to? How'd her last moments feel for you?
Pyp, Grenn?
How's this compare to Blackwater, for you?
The tracking shot... brilliant. I don't even have a question about it. It was easily the highlight of the episode for me. Shane and I discussed it while playing our NCAA football game online... and the only thing I think we've seen this year on tv that was better was True Detective's single shot scene.
I suppose there aren't many specific questions to ask... since everything happened in one place. I really liked this episode (I saw a bunch of comments about how intense it was, and i think it got my expectations up, but i didn't feel much intensity as much as just quality action), and think it's one definitely in the upper few for this season.
Non book reader take - I loved the episode. This and Blackwater have probably been my two favorites. I think the battle here was better than Blackwater, but I'd need to go back and watch to make sure.
ReplyDeleteTotally forgot Aemon was a Targaryen. It's.... interesting at least?
I ended up going 3-for-3 in the main characters die/survive game using my usual "the underdog always makes it out" theory. The Jon/Ygritte scene was extremely well-done and pretty affecting overall. I guess the silver lining is that if they stayed in that cave the White Walkers would've trounced em eventually. I don't think she ever had any intention to kill him. If she did, she would have before... She was a dead-eye archer.
I also loved that single shot. Very well done. The True Detective shot will probably be the "Secretariat in the Belmont" of single shots, but this one was definitely an A+.
I'm guessing the Giant Fight wasn't shown for budgetary reasons. Numerous internet reports state they went north of Blackwater's $8 million price tag, and I bet trying to show that fight would've pushed the episode past $10 million. HBO will clearly throw crazy money at this show (this season's budget was probably $75 million), but I have a feeling putting on that fight would have been a bridge just slightly too far.
Aye, that's exactly what Shane and I said about the tunnel scene... they had better things to put the money toward.
DeleteI think for me, Blackwater was the slightly better episode, but this was a better fight/action episode/sequence. Blackwater mixed in some slower, more dialogue heavy, scenes away from the battle that helped the episode's pace and general feel for me. Even son, both are fantastic episodes. This has been a impressively strong second halve to the season and should lead to a memorable finale
Blackwater was unquestionably the better episode for a lot of reasons:
ReplyDeleteThere's about a dozen characters in King's Landing more interesting than the most interesting person at the Wall. I'd much rather spend time with Bronn or Stannis (to say nothing of Tyrion, Sansa, the Hound, or Cersei) than Ygritte or Sam.
The Battle of Blackwater ended with a definitive result, whereas this one resolved nothing. The attackers south of the Wall have been dealt with, but nothing has fundamentally changed. It was a really strange place to end the episode, especially considering all that has to happen in the finale.
With a few exceptions, the dialogue was straightforward action fluff and character tropes. The gruff, unpopular leader who steps up and shows why he's leader in the first place, the scared kid who finds the courage at the perfect moment, the doomed standoff, the inexperienced guy who's never held a weapon before, the pompous asshole who reveals himself as a coward, and the battle raging around two characters as they have a quiet moment. The show is great because it avoids these cliches, oftentimes completely turning them on their heads and showing how pointless they are. This episode was built on them.
That being said, the episode was still very impressive. Marshall directed the shit out of it and all the money spent on it was apparent on the screen. The tracking shot was amazing, and the way he established the geography of the set was present throughout. It was reminiscent of a video game map. There's the forge with some backup weapons, there's the second floor hallways ideal for sniping, there's the elevator that reinforcements come out of. I wouldn't go so far as to compare it to True Detective's tracking shot, but it's in the ballpark at least.
ReplyDeleteYgritte's death totally worked for me. Loved everything about her and Jon's final interaction. The giants were all great, from the archer to Mag freaking out when one of them gets killed. The scythe was amazing. It's to the show's credit that I never questioned any effects. Everything looked as real as possible.
I liked the decision to cut away from the fight in the tunnel. What's in your imagination is likely greater than anything the show could have put together, and the interaction of actors with effects is where the illusion can break down. All the effects worked so well here because they were seperate from real life. When a giant is crushing a Night's Watchmen in his fist, it might not have looked as good.
This might be my least favorite episode of the season. I've never been a big fan of the Wall stuff in the show, though they've been improving it over the last two seasons. The setting doesn't have as much nuance as the rest of the world, and Kit Harington is probably the worst lead actor. I read something about how casting should have switched him and Richard Madden, so Harington would have died at the Red Wedding, and Madden, as the much more charismatic actor, would be filling the role of the Campbell-style hero. That makes a lot of sense to me, but oh well.
Interesting note about Harrington's acting. I think he's gotten better, and there was apparently a lot of praise for his improvements when it comes to fighting/sword work. I've never had issue where something has stood out for him in the negative. I would put him far above Emilia Clarke's acting when it comes to Daeny.
DeleteMaybe it's just this season Daeny, actually... as i don't really recall her being horrible in the first 3 seasons. This year, it just feels like she's mailed it in. I guess i just need the dragons around more to distract me.
DeleteI think he's always been a good physical actor, but I don't think he's got a lot of range. I've never been wowed by his performance, especially compared to Clarke, who's repeatedly knocked me on my ass. Her first season work is award-worthy. She could be one of those actors that is only as good as the writing/direction. See her work in season 2. It'll be interesting to see her in other things. That'll tell the tale.
DeleteI've never had a problem with Harrington's acting. There's just not much for him to do other than be a pretty plain guy. He's as close to Everyman as the show has.
DeleteClarke has had some week moments, but I think that's a result of the script. WHERE ARE MY DRAGONS WHERE ARE MY DRAGONS WHERE ARE MY DRAGONS
Addendum to our earlier conversation about Emmy awards. They've only submitted for supporting categories, and even then only a few actors.
ReplyDeletehttp://winteriscoming.net/2014/06/09/game-thrones-emmy-submissions-season-4/
I really feel like this episode could/should have been about 3 minutes longer. It just ended too quickly and it seemed pretty artificial at the end. No mourning for lost Brothers, just a trip to Mance. Maybe its because Jon feels guilty and responsible for Ygritte that he doesn't act like a normal person in looking for his friends and whatnot. I guess we're also to assume to this stuff happens off screen... I don't know. It just ended too quickly.
ReplyDelete